Medical Insurance in the US
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I ask because that is another sticking point. That there is no "incentive" for good health care.
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@BRRABill said:
I ask because that is another sticking point. That there is no "incentive" for good health care.
What's the incentive for good health care in the US? Patients aren't paying doctors, they pay insurance which makes money on you being sick. The incentive in the US is actually to keep you sick and therefore spend more money.
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@BRRABill said:
I ask because that is another sticking point. That there is no "incentive" for good health care.
My cousin is a doctor (GP) in Sarajevo, Bosnia. He makes about $866 USD per month, may not seem like a lot, but it's twice the average salary. That's the only one I can speak for, I'm sure you can look up others, but I know doctors in Western Europe make sometimes $1 million+ USD per year, depending.
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@BRRABill said:
I ask because that is another sticking point. That there is no "incentive" for good health care.
They are rarely paid "by patient". Meaning they don't make their money by seeing more people and definitely not be selling drugs. It's the insurance and pharma infrastructures in the US that primarily disrupt the healing incentive process. Most countries, certainly not all, pay something more similar to a flat rate - just paying them as a professional with a job to do. More like how we pay IT. Unlike IT, there isn't an unlimited about of work to do, there is incentive to make people healthy because it is your job, your source of pride and value, good for your community and country, good for humanity and you should be showing results similar or better than the average. In the US, some of those things exist, some do not.
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@scottalanmiller said:
@BRRABill said:
I ask because that is another sticking point. That there is no "incentive" for good health care.
They are rarely paid "by patient". Meaning they don't make their money by seeing more people and definitely not be selling drugs. It's the insurance and pharma infrastructures in the US that primarily disrupt the healing incentive process. Most countries, certainly not all, pay something more similar to a flat rate - just paying them as a professional with a job to do. More like how we pay IT. Unlike IT, there isn't an unlimited about of work to do, there is incentive to make people healthy because it is your job, your source of pride and value, good for your community and country, good for humanity and you should be showing results similar or better than the average. In the US, some of those things exist, some do not.
There are some physicians like this in the US that I know. Many of the prospective doctors that I know elected to go for Nurse Practitioner instead as it didn't involve as much pressure to push drugs on people.
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I pay for insurance in the US at a rate of $701 per month right now for a family of 4. This is a plan purchased via a broker and is with BCBS. Of course it is ACA compliant by law.
The plan lists one visit free. I assume that is the mandated wellness check.
My birthday is in April, and thus if I want a wellness check around my birthday like I do every year, I need to have an appointment then.
I was sick as hell in January. I refused to go to the doctor because it was January and it would eat my "free" visit. So my April visit would have to be paid for in full because it has to go against my (insanely stupid high) deductible.
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@JaredBusch Does the coverage for the rest of the family make as little sense as having yourself covered?
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@travisdh1 said:
@JaredBusch Does the coverage for the rest of the family make as little sense as having yourself covered?
That coverage is the same for the entire family.
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@JaredBusch said:
@travisdh1 said:
@JaredBusch Does the coverage for the rest of the family make as little sense as having yourself covered?
That coverage is the same for the entire family.
Ah, sorry, poorly worded question. I was wondering if the entire family actually ever hits the deductible?
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@travisdh1 said:
@JaredBusch said:
@travisdh1 said:
@JaredBusch Does the coverage for the rest of the family make as little sense as having yourself covered?
That coverage is the same for the entire family.
Ah, sorry, poorly worded question. I was wondering if the entire family actually ever hits the deductible?
No, because we have fortunately only been severely sick in Japan.
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@travisdh1 said:
@JaredBusch said:
@travisdh1 said:
@JaredBusch Does the coverage for the rest of the family make as little sense as having yourself covered?
That coverage is the same for the entire family.
Ah, sorry, poorly worded question. I was wondering if the entire family actually ever hits the deductible?
I hit my high deductible last year when I had my appendix removed. I ended up paying 2500$ out of pocket. Thankfully the company I was with at the time picked up the other 2500$.
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See that 20% coinsurance for an office visit? That is after you meet the deductible.
Here is the full PDF if anyone cares to look
https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=C44D01487196D328!8324&authkey=!ADqrFY3WI6208KE&ithint=file%2CPDF -
HOLY COW that IS a high deductible.
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@BRRABill said:
HOLY COW that IS a high deductible.
That is a pretty standard ACA compliant plan deductible.
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@JaredBusch said:
That is a pretty standard ACA compliant plan deductible.
Our company (15 people) has a $4,000 one and we complain about it.
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I have $4000 deductible. my employers pays first $1500, the plan cost me nothing. My wife has $1500 deductible, paid entirely by employer, plan costs her about $40 every 2 weeks. Last year we both had $0 cost plan, $2500 or $1500 deductible paid in full by employer. There are small copays after deductible, in $20-$50 range. Two years ago there was no copays, just deductible paid by employer of course. We already warned the employer that if insurance gets any worse, we're moving back to Europe.
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@marcinozga said:
I have $4000 deductible. my employers pays first $1500, the plan cost me nothing. My wife has $1500 deductible, paid entirely by employer, plan costs her about $40 every 2 weeks. Last year we both had $0 cost plan, $2500 or $1500 deductible paid in full by employer. There are small copays after deductible, in $20-$50 range. Two years ago there was no copays, just deductible paid by employer of course. We already warned the employer that if insurance gets any worse, we're moving back to Europe.
That's actually really good, and is how most insurance has been traditionally handled in the US. Which is also why very few people are really familiar with the true costs.
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@tonyshowoff said:
@iroal said:
@BRRABill said:
@iroal said:
Perhaps in minor Surgery, if you have a real problem, like cancer, there will no waiting, and of course It's Free
I do not know one way or the other.
The only real person I ever heard speak about it was a co-worker who moved from the US to England. They hated the system over there for elective type stuff.
A real example.
Last night I feel bad and with Flu, using Internet I get a date with my doctor this morning, doctor told me It was just a cold, She gave me the prescription for the medicaments.
I go to the pharmacy and bought the medicaments with a 80% of discount thanks to the prescription, I spend 2 €.
Of course visit the doctor is free.
I love this system.
A decent amount of Americans would respond one of these, if not all:
- You're lying
- That's socialism, we believe in freedom
- Yes but your taxes must be crazy!
- If that's true why do people come to America for healthcare?
- That's communism, we believe in freedom.
- Healthcare is not a right, it's a privilege (I see this one not that often, but often enough to where it's disturbing)
- Hey, if you can't pay, you deserve to be sick (I guess they forget about children and disabled)
- There's no such thing as free! My taxes! My taxes! (meanwhile they pay far more in health insurance, if they have it at all, than they would've paid in taxes).
I see this stuff all the time.
I work with bunch of rednecks and this is exactly what I hear. The problem with Americans, well, mostly with said rednecks, is they much rather have rights to own guns than right to have free healthcare. Too bad when they get sick, of their meth lab explodes and they storm the ER, average person has to pick up the tab, indirectly of course. I'd say, exercise your freedom, you have the right to refuse the medical care and you're free to die.
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@marcinozga said:
@tonyshowoff said:
@iroal said:
@BRRABill said:
@iroal said:
Perhaps in minor Surgery, if you have a real problem, like cancer, there will no waiting, and of course It's Free
I do not know one way or the other.
The only real person I ever heard speak about it was a co-worker who moved from the US to England. They hated the system over there for elective type stuff.
A real example.
Last night I feel bad and with Flu, using Internet I get a date with my doctor this morning, doctor told me It was just a cold, She gave me the prescription for the medicaments.
I go to the pharmacy and bought the medicaments with a 80% of discount thanks to the prescription, I spend 2 €.
Of course visit the doctor is free.
I love this system.
A decent amount of Americans would respond one of these, if not all:
- You're lying
- That's socialism, we believe in freedom
- Yes but your taxes must be crazy!
- If that's true why do people come to America for healthcare?
- That's communism, we believe in freedom.
- Healthcare is not a right, it's a privilege (I see this one not that often, but often enough to where it's disturbing)
- Hey, if you can't pay, you deserve to be sick (I guess they forget about children and disabled)
- There's no such thing as free! My taxes! My taxes! (meanwhile they pay far more in health insurance, if they have it at all, than they would've paid in taxes).
I see this stuff all the time.
I work with bunch of rednecks and this is exactly what I hear. The problem with Americans, well, mostly with said rednecks, is they much rather have rights to own guns than right to have free healthcare. Too bad when they get sick, of their meth lab explodes and they storm the ER, average person has to pick up the tab, indirectly of course. I'd say, exercise your freedom, you have the right to refuse the medical care and you're free to die.
That's the problem with social safety nets in the US... everyone who needs them is lazy and doesn't deserve them... until you need it... then everyone else is lazy and doesn't deserve them except you.
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@marcinozga said:
you're free to die.
We are only just now getting the right to die on our own terms in Canada, it's been quite the curfuffle as you'd expect of such a serious thing.
